Harold Blackorby
Member
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2007
- Messages
- 7
I was engraving a pendant and made hair line mark that I need to polish out , does anyone have any suggestions. the metal is sterling silver. Blackie
scratch remmoving
- Thread starter Harold Blackorby
- Start date
Weldon47
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Harold,
You may be successful at removing the scratch by burnishing over it with a highly polished burnishing tool. Be careful not to use too much force because the silver will deform easily resulting in a trough where the scratch was. The trick is to gently push the metal on either side of the cut toward the center where the sides will meet. Sometimes it is necessary to lightly sand after burnishing to completely remove evidence of the scratch.
Hope that helps,
Weldon
You may be successful at removing the scratch by burnishing over it with a highly polished burnishing tool. Be careful not to use too much force because the silver will deform easily resulting in a trough where the scratch was. The trick is to gently push the metal on either side of the cut toward the center where the sides will meet. Sometimes it is necessary to lightly sand after burnishing to completely remove evidence of the scratch.
Hope that helps,
Weldon
Billzach
Elite Cafe Member
When i,m carving a silver coin and get a scratch, I do just what Weldon recommended.
Blackie, Now days, commercial silver products are usually rhodium plated. For this reason you might not be able to get the scratch out by burnishing. Depends on how deep it is. If it is through the plating, you will have to remove the rhodium, burnish, polish and then re-rhodium to put it back to new like. this is far more trouble than it is worth usually, but if it belongs to a customer and can't be replaced, this would be your only option. Not good news I know, but other than that it might be possible to camaflage the scratch (some ornamental lines or something), but scratches are usually contrary to the direction of the work going off at oblique angles. It would depend on what you could figure out.............Hope this helps, but probably not..............Ron S
Getting out of trouble is an art in itself.
Getting out of trouble is an art in itself.
Marcus Hunt
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Why do they rhodium plate commercial silver products Ron?
FANCYGUN
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Marcus,
They plate the silver, especially chains, to prevent them from tarnishing and leaving a beautiful black smudge on your shirts. On earring findings it can also prevent infections due to the tarnish in the pierced ear. Many woman still cannot wear earrings with silver findings reguardless.
They plate the silver, especially chains, to prevent them from tarnishing and leaving a beautiful black smudge on your shirts. On earring findings it can also prevent infections due to the tarnish in the pierced ear. Many woman still cannot wear earrings with silver findings reguardless.
Weldon47
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Good info,
I made the mistake of thinking this was a solid silver piece he had made himself. Wow, I should know better!
Still learning,
Weldon
I made the mistake of thinking this was a solid silver piece he had made himself. Wow, I should know better!
Still learning,
Weldon
Hi Marcus,
Americans or Canadians, for that matter simply don't get what butlers are supposed to do.
Having someone who understands silver didn't quite make it over the ocean or was forgotten.
Hand polishing a sterling service could be a full time thing. One of the things a good butler did or does.
Sterling being a product that needs to polished up every once in a while or it goes black.
The black is copper oxide. I sure you know that. Rhodium plate simple puts a barrier
between copper in the sterling and the air.
Most modern silver is triple plate. Because the silver is more like a sponge, and something
you plate today will become dull after a while because the Rhodium goes into the silver.
This is called migration.
To prevent this, there is one layer of Copper for the next layer to stick to.
The second layer is nickel that provide a true barrier to the Oxygen.
The third layer is Rhodium because it's pretty and close in shade to silver or white gold.
Argentium silver was suppose to help because they replacing the copper. From what
I've heard, they simple traded one set of problems for another, not quite so bad.
To summarize; don't make a mistake when your doing silver. Not an easy thing because it's
slippery. I hope your lucky and it's not plated so Weldon's method can cure the scratch
without having to refinish. (this is mostly for new engravers to watch out for.)
Americans or Canadians, for that matter simply don't get what butlers are supposed to do.
Having someone who understands silver didn't quite make it over the ocean or was forgotten.
Hand polishing a sterling service could be a full time thing. One of the things a good butler did or does.
Sterling being a product that needs to polished up every once in a while or it goes black.
The black is copper oxide. I sure you know that. Rhodium plate simple puts a barrier
between copper in the sterling and the air.
Most modern silver is triple plate. Because the silver is more like a sponge, and something
you plate today will become dull after a while because the Rhodium goes into the silver.
This is called migration.
To prevent this, there is one layer of Copper for the next layer to stick to.
The second layer is nickel that provide a true barrier to the Oxygen.
The third layer is Rhodium because it's pretty and close in shade to silver or white gold.
Argentium silver was suppose to help because they replacing the copper. From what
I've heard, they simple traded one set of problems for another, not quite so bad.
To summarize; don't make a mistake when your doing silver. Not an easy thing because it's
slippery. I hope your lucky and it's not plated so Weldon's method can cure the scratch
without having to refinish. (this is mostly for new engravers to watch out for.)
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One thing about rhodium. When you have worked with silver, you begin to recognize the almost chrome look that rhodium produces. That is your only clue as the article will say sterling if it is a commercial product., so that particular shine is different from silver. Silver is a very white shine, not chromy looking, but then that just takes experience too. Something to watch out for like the guys said. Know what you are working on. take sample cuts and that isn't always conclusive, but it helps. Rhodium is extremely hard to get off of sterling without a reverse plating process. To polish it off is a drag. It even has a rockwell hardness to it, although I don't know what it is. It cuts alright, but be very careful not to slip on it. the slightest scratch will be hard to get out. Rhodium is harder than the base metal (silver) so you can't polish it off without taking it all off. Sanding it off is another way but that will be determined by the countours of the article and whether you can get into all of the areas to sand. There is an awful lot to know about repair and refinishing, but it is a common thing in an engraving shop, requiring the proper polishing and plating systems etc. I could ramble on and on about this, but the main thing is be careful.......There are quite a lot of booby traps out there for the novice......Ron S
Marcus Hunt
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Thanks for answering my question so fully guys. Plating seems to be an awful lot of effort especially the 'triple plating' you describe. Personally I wouldn't buy the shiney plated silver stuff as to my eye it always looks cheap. The one thing I love and adore about silver is the way it oxidizes. When the highlights polish the contrast is beautiful. Still, it's horses for courses I suppose. I know they rhodium plate white gold rings too and once again this seems to me to take away from having white gold in the first place. Personally I won't touch plated stuff and always recommend getting it machine engraved. Recently however, I had to engrave an antique, nickel plated, sword scabbard for the Queen and it cut beautifully with no flaking whatsoever.
lesholmes
Elite Cafe Member
There is a practical reason for plating white gold rings - many people are alergic to the nickel used to make the gold turn white. The plating keeps the nickel in the alloy from making a rash on the owner's finger.
Les
Les
Haraga.com
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Certain white gold alloys are rhodium plated to hide any yellow gold color that may be showing. Palladium white does not need to be plated.
PS_Bond
Elite Cafe Member
Nickel-bearing white gold hasn't been allowed to be sold in the EU since 2000, purely because of the levels of nickel allergy. Palladium whites are the usual here now.
Of course, as of next year, palladium will have its own hallmark according to the guys at Assay Office London. Wonder how that engraves?
Of course, as of next year, palladium will have its own hallmark according to the guys at Assay Office London. Wonder how that engraves?
Hi Marcus,
From your mouth to God's ear, but I wouldn't bet on it. Rich folk have the butlers over here
polishing the Porsche rather than the silver tea set. I think the only place where they still do that
sort of thing is in the White House or Parliament in Ottawa. Most tea sets hear have a copper core,
with lead feet and handles. So if you doing an inscription on a tea service and the letters
your cutting have a copper color?! It's silver plate. No mistakes allowed.
From your mouth to God's ear, but I wouldn't bet on it. Rich folk have the butlers over here
polishing the Porsche rather than the silver tea set. I think the only place where they still do that
sort of thing is in the White House or Parliament in Ottawa. Most tea sets hear have a copper core,
with lead feet and handles. So if you doing an inscription on a tea service and the letters
your cutting have a copper color?! It's silver plate. No mistakes allowed.
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Marcus Hunt
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Oh to go back to the days of 'Sheffield plate'!
A stock maker friend of mine who lives in Maine used to make stock ovals out of old silver quarters. He made one for his writer buddy's shotgun and all was well until he started to file it up for me to engrave. He'd used one of the wrong date and of course the copper broke through. His buddy thought this was hysterical and still went ahead and had it engraved just for the added value of having this story to tell.
A stock maker friend of mine who lives in Maine used to make stock ovals out of old silver quarters. He made one for his writer buddy's shotgun and all was well until he started to file it up for me to engrave. He'd used one of the wrong date and of course the copper broke through. His buddy thought this was hysterical and still went ahead and had it engraved just for the added value of having this story to tell.
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