Question: Convex liners?

[Roger B]

I don't recall seeing any but is it possible to purchase convex liners? Probably 4 - 6 lines and not too fine. :thinking:

Many thanks,
Roger

 

[allan621]

Are you talking about something like this?

The cutting lines are on the top.

I have a few of them, all liners, that I received from Muller instead of the normal concave cutters with the lines on the bottom. This was about forty years ago. For some reason they didn't want them back. Never knew what they were for and never used them. Send me your address by private message and I'll ship them to you. If there is a way you can avoid custom duties let me know and I'll try to handle that.

Allan

 

[Roger B]

Thanks Allan, they might actually work. I'm after a cut which looks like it is cut with a wider round graver and these look they might deliver.

I'll send a PM

Roger

 

[Brian Marshall]

I have some too, also at least 40 years old. They were used by printmakers and as "trick" gravers to frost/background & Florentine in difficult situations.

When you actually need one, as in the case of a parachute - nothing else will suffice.


They are carbon steel, so there is no reason the standard procedure of coating, heating, bending, hardening and tempering would not work... just bent the other way.


Brian

 

[Brian Marshall]

However, if you are looking for a liner with the teeth in a convex arrangement - the factory liners like Allan showed ain't gonna do it. The profile is straight across when you look at it from the end.


Those you'd have to make, putting the convex profile on, hand cutting the lines one at a time on an annealed carbon steel blank. Then the hardening and tempering.

This would give you a "scooped", lined effect. I think I built one once, thinking I needed it for something - but later abandoned it?

No idea where it might be, but since I never throw gravers out - it's around here someplace...


Brian

 

[Southern Custom]

Have I just lost a few IQ points or am I missing something here. Where would one use a convex liner that a straight wouldn't do the job? I've got half a dozen concave for the occasional bowl but convex? What kind of application would this cover?

 

[Southern Custom]

are we talking about the bottom of the graver having a convex profile rather than flat or round? I think I was confusing concave for "bent graver", teeth on bottom and convex as bent graver, teeth on top which had my brain in knots. I'm confusing myself now!

 

[jerrywh]

Brian Marshall is one sharp cat. I never have seen one but I suppose there could be a need. I run into all kinds of different problems with my projects.
Like Brian says, You ought to make some. I make tiny files and such on a common basis cutting the teeth by hand.

 

[Brian Marshall]

I'll try to find a couple later today and post 'em. They are kinda hard to wrap your mind around - but they do have their uses... occasionally.

Like I said, mostly printmakers and a few banknote engravers are the only people I've ever seen use them much. Robert Swartley showed me a couple of his some years ago.

Over the years, you'll see all kinds of trick gravers that guys have come up with to do specific jobs or cuts - a long ways away from the familiar standard "V" or flats.


Brian

 

[silverchip]

I have seen U liners made by Muller.

 

[Roger B]

Thanks for the responses.

I had in mind that they could be used for patterning the inside of petal shapes such as the orange blossom pattern in wedders - the liners would create a cut similar to a round graver but with a texture.

Roger

 

[Brian Marshall]

Oh yeah, just remembered who uses convex liners the most - die makers!


Found 'em in an old (25 year+) Gesswein Tool & Die Makers catalog.

NOT the Jewelry Tools catalog. Back then they had separate catalogs, dunno if they still do?

Lots of good stuff you never saw in the Jewelers catalogs.


B.

 

[John B.]

You are right on David. I have some round bottom liners made by Muller and like them very much.
They are great and easy when you want the start or finish a series of lines to be on a bias just by rolling the liner.
Not saying it can't be done with a flat bottom liner but it's walk in the park with a round bottom.
I have seen round bottoms in both straight and curved liner styles.
Curved liners are usually bent and hardened after the lines are cut into the blank so no big deal.

 

[silverchip]

If my memory serves me right, the print makers used them to build clouds in a scene by rolling them on a bias plane like John said!!!! Also you could use it to create shadow and reflection on water .

 

[John B.]

If my memory serves me right, the print makers used them to build clouds in a scene by rolling them on a bias plane like John said!!!! Also you could use it to create shadow and reflection on water .

Dave, That's what I use them for. And find them handy for many other effects. Rotated off one corner they indicate the end of a bird feather in tick marks.Or a snake or lizard scale.
But this can also be done with a fine flat liner (think Ngraver#10, narrow or medium) with the front ground to a radius.

 

[Southern Custom]

Now I understand. I was ridiculously confused here when I saw reference to concave and convex. I see now that you were referring to a standard round bottom liner. and Yes, they are handy to have around. I haven't had one out of the back of the drawer in a long time but I'll definitely have to think about application a bit harder. Might be some fun effects to be had.

 

[tdelewis]

Is there anyone who could post a photo of what is being discussed?

 

[monk]

Is there anyone who could post a photo of what is being discussed?

i'd like to see a foto of such. i got lost with all the words.

 

[Roger B]

I don't have a photo but imagine a round graver that leaves lines rather than a flat liner.

 

[monk]

I don't have a photo but imagine a round graver that leaves lines rather than a flat liner.

ok, tyvm. that's very clear.