Question: For what purpose do you use Onglette graver

[SalihKara]

Hi,

I have always used V shape graver in different angles like 90-105-110 degree.

I wonder what the main purpose of Onglette is.

Doest it worth to make one and try it to cut scrool design ?

Is there any advantage of Onglette ?

 

[John B.]

SalihKara,
I use an onglette graver for several purposes.
It is an excellent tool for cutting line borders or where characterless lines are required.
It is more forgiving of any variation in depth and width.
The ongelette is my "go to tool" for cutting the first layout lines for gold inlays or borders.
It is an excellent tool for removing background in very tightly confined areas.
I find it has many other uses as well. Give it a try and I think you will be rewarded.

 

[FANCYGUN]

I,m with John on the ongalette for the same reasons I find it a very smooth cutting tool and i use it for my gold inlay lines i also use it with a slightly rounded heel for recutting roll die markings it was the first style of engraving tool that i used when i started to engrave and it is very easy to sharpen by eyeball

 

[sam]

SalihKara,
I use an onglette graver for several purposes.
It is an excellent tool for cutting line borders or where characterless lines are required.
It is more forgiving of any variation in depth and width.
The ongelette is my "go to tool" for cutting the first layout lines for gold inlays or borders.
It is and excellent tool for removing background in very tightly confined areas.
I find it has many other uses as well. Give it a try and I think you will be rewarded.

Winston Churchill uses them exclusively.

How do you sharpen yours, John? I've seen some sharpen facets on them essentially turning them into square gravers, but Winston's are curved. I haven't used them much myself and have probably been overlooking a great tool.

 

[silverchip]

That is the first tool I learned to cut steel with from John, Still run them today in several configuration with air and HC for inlays. Best lesson I ever got !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[John B.]

Winston Churchill uses them exclusively.

How do you sharpen yours, John? I've seen some sharpen facets on them essentially turning them into square gravers, but Winston's are curved. I haven't used them much myself and have probably been overlooking a great tool.

Hello Sam and thank you. This is how I sharpen my regular ongelettes after establishing the desired face angle
The hand held graver bottom is raised at approximately 15 degrees above the stone or lap and given a quick wipe or two from side to side to create the heel.

And like Marty said, I cut my first borders or inlay lines with it and then round off and thicken the heel and recut if I want a wider line or inlay.

Many of the German and Austrian engravers cut facets on ongrlettes to make very narrow V-tools and some of the great Russian engraver/sculptors flatten one side to create a vertical knife edge for deep work and for shaving surfaces.

The ongelette is a very versatile tool and deserves more use IMO.

 

[John B.]

That is the first tool I learned to cut steel with from John, Still run them today in several configuration with air and HC for inlays. Best lesson I ever got !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks Dave, but with your talent you could do it with a rusty concrete nail.

 

[sam]

Prudhomme used them as well. I must have 2 dozen of his chisels and hand gravers which are onglettes.

Thank you John!

 

[mitch]

i used onglettes much more early in my career, but moved away from them for most general use because those old Lyon & Muller gravers just didn't hold a point in steel like carbide, momax, and the other hi-speed lathe bit stock we were repurposing. however, now that GRS is offering them in modern materials, pre-ground for QC chucks, perhaps i'll be revisiting them.

i still have quite few for relief detail, deep corners, etc., but never use them for any general stuff.

 

[JJ Roberts]

When I started engraving the onglette was my tool of choice for the use with H&C and hand push graver's the onglette was my main tool for scrolls,boards, background removal,shading and game scenes and still sharpen them by hand with stones. J.J.

 

[tdelewis]

The first tool I used. I sharpened by hand Keeping the same profile when putting a heel on.

 

[John B.]

i used onglettes much more early in my career, but moved away from them for most general use because those old Lyon & Muller gravers just didn't hold a point in steel like carbide, momax, and the other hi-speed lathe bit stock we were repurposing. however, now that GRS is offering them in modern materials, pre-ground for QC chucks, perhaps i'll be revisiting them.

i still have quite few for relief detail, deep corners, etc., but never use them for any general stuff.

Hello Mitch,
Yes, the GRS ongelettes are very good and hold up pretty well in most steel.
But if you have a particularly tough metal to work on it's easy to shape and fabricate an ongelette from a graver material or blank of your choice.

 

[rmgreen]

This thread has bee particularly informative thread. Thanks to all those with experience for sharing their knowledge. Invaluable information. The most valuable part of this forum IMO.

 

[JJ Roberts]

When cutting boards be sure the onglette is evenly sharpen on both sides if it not it will drift off course to one or the other,Scrib a line and make a cut on a practice plate. J.J.

 

[FANCYGUN]

It doesnt take long to grind one out of drill rod or whatever you like using you dont need much of a heel i even tried one of Alain Lovenbergs gravers with no heel and mike dubber and I were shocked as to how smooth and easy it push cut
I sharpen mine just like it is shown in Meeks book real quick and easy with no expensive jigs other than face angle

 

[Roger Bleile]

When I visited the gun engraving school in Suhl, Germany, everyone was cutting H&C with an onglette. I also visited the engraving studio at the Gebrüder Merkel and found most of the engravers there using an onglette. My first cuts were with an onglette chisel that my brother made for me. I used it a lot in my H&C days.

 

[John B.]

Another couple of good uses for the ongelette.
They can be easily converted into a miniature flat.
If you keep the flat heel very short you wind up with a narrow flat with taper behind the cutting edge, thereby reducing heel drag on curves.
You can also create a little notch in the bottom behind the ongelette/flat edge to negotiate curves without heel drag.
This notched ongelette/flat will also "reach over" engraved elements or borders when relieving background.
The ongelette is a very useful and versatile tool.

 

[sam]

Another couple of good uses for the ongelette.
They can be easily converted into a miniature flat.
If you keep the flat heel very short you wind up with a narrow flat with taper behind the cutting edge, thereby reducing heel drag on curves.
You can also create a little notch in the bottom behind the ongelette/flat edge to negotiate curves without heel drag.
This notched ongelette/flat will also "reach over" engraved elements or borders when relieving background.
The ongelette is a very useful and versatile tool.

I have several versions of notched gravers for various things. One I copied from Alain for trimming edges in relief engraving, and it’s an onglette. Sure makes you sad when they break since they can only be resharpened a few times.

 

[Doc Mark]

Other than corner relief cutting where I don't need to go around a curve, I've never had any luck with onglettes. Unless I turn it into a miniature "flat" as has been mentioned above, I could never keep a point intact. I've not tried the new tougher alloys. Maybe it is time to try them again.

 

[JJ Roberts]

The only problem I had with the onglette in the beginning was cutting the clockwise scroll half way around the scroll the tip would break,:no:after that I thought why not cut the clockwise scroll from the inside out.Problem solved. J.J.