Printable drawings for practice plates

[Dani Girl]

I thought I would share some tracings I have been doing for study purposes that I thought might be of use for new engravers starting out. I'm not sure whose work each belongs to, some old some new, some big names in engraving. Would this be OK or would I put noses out of joint putting high detail jpgs and pdfs of their work up here for others to study or try to cut?

 

[Adder]

Danae. Sounds like a fantastic idea if they where only used for practice. But I don`t know if anyone will be offended. Probably a lot of people in this forum to answer your question better than me

Jørn-Ove

 

[tdelewis]

I don't think that artists like having their work copied for any purpose. Most artists like to protect their skill and ideas. If you have noticed any of Sam A's work is always copyrighted and thus protected. However, there may be those who would be willing to help advance the art and be glad to share ideas for practice.

 

[Travis Fry]

I've noticed that engravers are a lot more prickly about this kind of thing than basically any other group of artisans I've come across (and, as a serial hobbyist, I've been part of dozens of different artisan communities over the years). Most members of most craft communities are content if either 1) it's just used for practice and not for sale or 2) if used for sale, design credit is given. But engravers seem to really care a lot about this, and would probably not be ok with either 1) or especially 2) without explicit permission. It reminds me of the knifemaking community back in the 1970's and 1980's (before my time, but the memory endures), which has thankfully let that go for the sake of promoting the craft over individual territorialism. I think it's a little silly, but I accept it as a rule of the game.

 

[AllenClapp]

I thought I would share some tracings I have been doing for study purposes that I thought might be of use for new engravers starting out. I'm not sure whose work each belongs to, some old some new, some big names in engraving. Would this be OK or would I put noses out of joint putting high detail jpgs and pdfs of their work up here for others to study or try to cut?

If anyone wants something to use to practice cutting, instead of design, attached are a couple of pages that I did several years ago to get my hand and eye back into cutting uniformly straight or curved lines, or cutting tiny curves, if I had not been cutting for a bit. They are certainly NOT any kind of great design, but they will function to get your hands and eyes in sync. Feel free to use and share. They will fit 2"x2" practice plates.

 

[T.G.III]

I know that I've paid for a ton of study material from the various masters that have put such work out, they all say the same thing as far as sharing the paid for content,

please don't

 

[Dani Girl]

SO, what is the rule, if it's more than 100 years old what i'm tracing that would be OK?

 

[monk]

i'd be very cautious about this. copywrite should be respected. posting any material without proper consent can open a "can of worms". there's so very much material that is "free" for the public to use i wont even list the sources here. one thing none of the free stuff addresses is design concepts. as one develops practice with cutting, learning how to assemble the practice cuts into an attractive design is kinda mandatory. jn2cw

 

[AllenClapp]

The length of the copyright depends upon when the work was done to some extent. There is a nice explanatory circular from the US Patent Office that explains it. If the work is recent, the copyright extends for 70 years after the author's life. If I read this correctly, any work done before January 1, 1928 are in the public domain. Different countries have different copyright laws, so that is also an issue. See: https://www.google.com/search?q=us+...i390i650l4.10137j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

[AllenClapp]

The length of the copyright depends upon when the work was done to some extent. There is a nice explanatory circular from the US Patent Office that explains it. If the work is recent, the copyright extends for 70 years after the author's life. If I read this correctly, any work done before January 1, 1928 are in the public domain. Different countries have different copyright laws, so that is also an issue. See: https://www.google.com/search?q=us+...i390i650l4.10137j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Click on the HOW LONG DOES A COPYRIGHT LAST secton from the US Copyright Office to get the circular.

 

[FANCYGUN]

Copywrite or not, we all copy to some extent. However, when you make a direct copy on a piece and then sell it as your original work, it crosses the line. I have seen this done on a few of my engravings and I called out the engraver to remove the listing that was for sale stating it was a direct, and rather poor copy, of one of my works.
To make life simple, just buy Sam's book with tons of copy able patterns for you to use. That is what the book was printed for. They are great designs to learn from in may different styles. If you are going to copy in order to learn, copy a good pattern and not someone else s mistakes.

 

[silverchip]

As far as I know an artist copyright is good for one year unless registered at which point it can be extended by the artist.

 

[Goldjockey]

As far as I know an artist copyright is good for one year unless registered at which point it can be extended by the artist.

A Copyright comes into existence the moment a work is fixed in tangible form. Registration is advisable if one wishes to protect their copyrighted work, and generally speaking it becomes necessary if there is litigation or a legal dispute involving copying, or unauthorized reproduction of a copyrighted work. I am not an attorney, and this is not legal advice, but my understanding is that f one should register within 5 years of a work's creation to take advantage of statutory protection. I believe if a work is registered within 6 months of publication, it enjoys enhance statutory protection, and enhanced claims for damages. My understanding is that a copyright remains in effect for the life of the creator of the registered work, and remains in effect 50 years after the creator's passing. It can also be renewed by heirs, successors and assignees.

 

[allan621]

Copyright law is why lawyers were invented. Goldjockey is right about his understanding copyright law. I can give an actual example.

I created a jewelry design 22 years ago. It was made into a completely hand made pendant by me and listed in the store's catalog under my name. I sold over 400 of those gold pendants in 2 years. From the moment the catalog was printed it established an author, a design and a date of first issue.

Now the stupid thing I didn't do was actually register it with the copyright office. It still has copyright standing with me as the author and I keep a copy of the original catalog as proof of authorship. Luckily I've never seen anything close to mine. With the standing copyright from publishing I could have had rights of seizure of counterfeit and recovery of lost income. It would be hard because a lawyer would have to involved and worked through the courts to establish who actually owns the design.

BUT, if I had registration I would have prima facie evidence of ownership, been able to seize counterfeit items, sue for stolen income, plus statutory damages beyond how much revenue I would have recovered and
( here's the important part ) lawyers fees and court costs.

You can publish designs for other to copy and allow it to be available for public use. If you publish it online with your name, if it a unique design not just a variation; you have a copyright on it, even if you allow public use at will, even if you don't want the copyright, there is one established. And copying others work to understand how something was done is an acceptable practice, as long as you don't claim it as your own, as long its marked as yours. Artists have done this since cave drawings.

But unlike 22 years ago, two things have changed. One is that just about everything is reproducible with little trouble. The other is that with internet listing millions of people may see your work. And millions of people may be tempted to steal your work. The store catalog I was in, had 12000 copies printed. That same store now has over a million internet visits a year.

A friend suggested I start making the pendants again to keep busy during retirement. I made a variation which makes it better. And it will have a registered copyright attached to it.

Allan

 

[Dani Girl]

I am listening folks. I do respect copyright and not undermining folks ability to make a living doing their thing.

but

it feels a little like we tell folk to learn how to engrave in a similar way to someone being told to go learn to speak Japanese, but don't copy anyone else's words and don't even study someone actually speaking Japanese... just come up with something original.

so what CAN we do to help some new or even intermediate engravers advance.

Sam Alfano's training resources are about as good as they come. Lee Griffiths book. (on that note why don't we start listing here what the best study resources we have all seen are??).

I do see a possibility of putting pictures up here and finding them laser engraved on some cheap knives or something some day, but if I really cared I wouldn't share. So what if I see my work again some day? I'll live. Others in a different position who make a career out of this would probably be more bothered.

 

[allan621]

Dani

The whole entanglement of intellectual property rights became really muddled in the 1990's when two members of the rock group, The Turtles, sued hip hop artist DeLaSoul for using a small portion of their music in one of his numbers. It was about 20 seconds of music that was looped and filled about a minute of album time. They settled out of court for about 2 million dollars. ( Memory fades when you get to your 70's ). Lawsuits took off after that as artists really started paying attention to who is using what of theirs.

Artists who create for money should not have their work copied without permission. And copyright notices are statements of that. If they didn't care they would put out drawings without copyright notices, even though copyright may exist since its been put into a tangible format.

But, there are books which can be purchased that can be copied for individual use. Not just Sam's book ( which is the best available, the variations of engravings are amazing ) but whole libraries from companies like Dover publications along with video downloads from Sam and many other fine engravers. I have a book from Dover detailing Japanese Crest designs and it states how many designs you can use before a copyright violation occurs.

And that brings me to the idea you have of listing study guides, probably for various levels of ability. Its a great idea. Like beginners could start with Allen Clapps Practice Lines template. Reminds me of how I would start some engravers by playing a game called " just follow the line dammit and only follow the line with no improvements" . Allen's template is better than anything I ever came up with and for a beginning engraver it's ideal. It reminds me of the Karate Kid's wipe on, wipe off. Get the eyes and brains ready to do more involved steps.

It would take a bit of work to expand after that. Any ideas what could be next?

Allan

 

[Dani Girl]

How much is involved with claiming a copyright on a drawing?

 

[EngraverHand]

I didn’t read all the comments, but I have had several of my designs copied and used for engraving without being asked or mentioned.. I have seen my designs copied and claimed it’s theirs original. I have even been contacted and offered to buy my own designs from people trying to make money on it. I have found it made on t-shirts and other things.. all that makes me quite angry, but almost impossible to avoid as long as I put it up for display on the World Wide Web..

Some designs I have made for clients, and they have paid well and I definitely would not like that to be for someone to practice..

But I have had people contacting me and asked if they can use specific designs for practice, and if it’s not something I have sold or want to engrave myself I always say yes, because they are kind asking.. and they will mention where the design comes from if they post it online.

unless they are very old I would not put up something for others to use unless you know who the artist is and have asked for permission.

I’m probably not in your list of designs, but my advice would be to always ask for permission first, and if you don’t know the artist, don’t post it for this reason

 

[AllenClapp]

How much is involved with claiming a copyright on a drawing?

Check your countries copyright and patent office for procedures and forms. they differ.

 

[AllenClapp]

Check your countries copyright and patent office for procedures and forms. they differ.

Gotta love spellcheckers! I should have said to check your country's copyright and patent office.