Question about heat treating

[dbeck]

When making punches and background tools out of drill rod do you heat treat the entire tool or just the working tip?
Thanks in advance.
Derek

 

[Chujybear]

depends on the gauge of the stock I’m using to work with.
I will normalize the tool if I’m doing any forging of it. If the shaping is just with files, then, obviously, a normalization cycle would not be necessary.

If it is pretty thin stock, I might harden the whole thing. And then temper from the back of the tool allowing the yellow or bronze temper to creep forward while the rest of the tool becomes a fare bit softer (tougher).

You can still do that with heavier stock (1/4”) but I just do the tip.

 

[monk]

the tip is really the concern. the back end need not be hardened. if left soft, in time,it will begin to "mushroom" a bit.

 

[TLP]

I make design stamps for sw style silver work and I was taught to heat treat the entire pc to non magnetic, quench, polish back the scale and begin heating from the struck end. as the tool turns blue on the struck end watch the light straw color work its way down the length of the tool when the straw color just about reaches the end of the tool quench. after I start to heat the tool I will pick it up by the struck end and hold the pc over a bucket of water as i work the colors down the length of the shaft. I do this as the working end of the tool will change color very fast as you are heating it and I have better luck getting it quenched holding it over the bucket. My mentor calls this a differential heat treat and he uses this on the spine of the knives he makes

 

[John B.]

Foolproof heat treating of small steel parts.
For punches or gravers I raise the heat to non-magnetic temp while holding the strike or tang end with pliers.
Polish the whole thing to remove the heat scale.
Using a meat loaf pan I bury the parts in clean aquarium sand or powdered lime.
An hour or so before bedtime I put the pan with buried parts in the house oven at 325 degrees.
At bed time I turn off the oven without opening the door. this allows a very slow overnight cooling.
Next morning I find the parts with a perfect light straw color from end to end.
No mushrooming on the strike or the active end.
Always use eye protection when striking punches with a hammer.

 

[mitch]

could you guys be more specific about what steels you're using for these various techniques? are you all using O1 or? last i looked, "drill rod" comes in all sorts of stuff these days.

 

[John B.]

could you guys be more specific about what steels you're using for these various techniques? are you all using O1 or? last i looked, "drill rod" comes in all sorts of stuff these days.

Hello Mitch , and thank you for all your good input and info.
For homemade punches and gravers I start out with fully annealed O1 drill rod or square stock.
When I make my 1/16" round gravers in the 3/32" brass tube I use fully hardened Cobalt, M-42 or micro grain carbide depending upon their intended use.

 

[dbeck]

could you guys be more specific about what steels you're using for these various techniques? are you all using O1 or? last i looked, "drill rod" comes in all sorts of stuff these days.

I have O1 for the tools I’m making. I made a blade type flat punch for background work today and just heat treated the working end. Worked great.

 

[DKanger]

I once tried forging 01 drill rod on the flat of my machinist vise. It exploded when I hit it with the hammer. Don't know why other than the vise may have been too cold at the time.

 

[dbeck]

I once tried forging 01 drill rod on the flat of my machinist vise. It exploded when I hit it with the hammer. Don't know why other than the vise may have been too cold at the time.

Yikes. Forging is a whole other skill I don’t know if I have time in my life to learn. Maybe it was to hot? This 1/8 still rod worked real nice. It cooled fast but forged and hardened nice.

 

[John B.]

I once tried forging 01 drill rod on the flat of my machinist vise. It exploded when I hit it with the hammer. Don't know why other than the vise may have been too cold at the time.

O1 tool steel needs to be heated to bright red hot for forging
If it is forged cold or at a low temperature it will form stress cracks or shatter dangerously
.

 

[JJ Roberts]

dbeck, I recommend you buy your dot punch's from Ray Phillips at Ngraver you get three nice punch's for $15.00, ask for Brian 860-892-9015. J.J.

 

[Chujybear]

could you guys be more specific about what steels you're using for these various techniques? are you all using O1 or? last i looked, "drill rod" comes in all sorts of stuff these days.

o1, slices of leaf spring, uncoiled bedsprings... all similar results

 

[dbeck]

dbeck, I recommend you buy your dot punch's from Ray Phillips at Ngraver you get three nice punch's for $15.00, ask for Brian 860-892-9015. J.J.

He can’t get anyone to make them so he is out. I tried.

 

[JJ Roberts]

That a shame,Ray made some really good tools been dealing with him since the 70's. J.J.

 

[Leland Davis]

dbeck, Tira Mitchell sells beading punches. They are made for jewelry so a little to hard for steel.I put them in my heat treat oven at 400 degrees for 15 minutes and let them cool slow. I finished 2 stainless Ruger vaqueros beading all the background with 2 punches and they are priced right.
good luck, Leland

 

[dbeck]

dbeck, Tira Mitchell sells beading punches. They are made for jewelry so a little to hard for steel.I put them in my heat treat oven at 400 degrees for 15 minutes and let them cool slow. I finished 2 stainless Ruger vaqueros beading all the background with 2 punches and they are priced right.
good luck, Leland

Thank you Ill check it out.

 

[mitch]

i've had excellent results with dot punches from Otto Frei.

 

[Leland Davis]

mitch, do the Otto Frei punches hold up to stainless?
thanks,Leland

 

[mitch]

mitch, do the Otto Frei punches hold up to stainless?
thanks,Leland

that's almost all i've used them on and have been very impressed.