Question: rose gold

[Ste82]

Hi guys!
i think i have a problem...i've bought some 0,5mm rose gold wire, i have annealed it quenching immediately in water, but it is still much harder than i was expecting, something similar to non annealed copper.
my intention was to inlay it in rather large areas, about 7mm x 15 mm, but now i'm not so sure i will be able to do it!
On the forum there are some wonderful works with rose gold inlay, there is some trick i don't know or this hardness is normal?
I hope some one can help me because i hate the idea to throw away all this gold!!!!
Thanks in advance,
Ste

 

[silverchip]

What is the karat?? Would be my first Q. and if you are inlaying a strip that large,why not use a piece of sheet gold?? There is some information on annealing rose gold in the tips archive,I believe. just some thought that come to mind.

 

[Ste82]

Hi Silverchip,
Thank you for the response! The gold is a 18 Kt...i know a lot of people use sheet gold, but i've always used wire and maybe i'm wrong but i think with wire i have less waste, i'm not a goldsmith and i dont have the stuff to melt and laminate it, so probably wire is a better choice for me.
And in this case if wire is hard i think a sheet could be more difficult to inlay?

 

[silverchip]

Actually the sheet method in this case would be my preference.I also think that your gold did not anneal properly. Even so, you are going to have an uphill battle.The less you have to try to beat this into the cavity, the better. Just my .02.

 

[Tim Wells]

You might pick Ray Cover's or Brian Hochstrat's brain as they do a lot of different colored gold inlay on those knives they do.

 

[Brian Marshall]

18K rose is one of the worst alloys you can work with - IMHO...

Not only is the annealing temperature critical, the fabricated pieces I am sent to engrave seem to actually tear when engraving under the microscope.

"Normal" alloys shear cleanly. This stuff has a ragged edge.

Tried every remedy I know of - lubricants, graver angles, black candles and incense - no joy.

Been working with the stuff on a regular basis for 4 or 5 years now. Always wince when I see it on a job order.

I would not try to inlay the stuff. Prone to fractures when it work hardens.


Brian


By the way, I anneal it in alcohol not water - to keep from getting fractures when rolling into sheet or wire. When the red fades, just before the black.

 

[Brian Marshall]

Since I posted the above, I just finished machining an 18K diamond setting from factory made seamless tubing.

It galls, unlike the 14K red I worked with yesterday.


Your first resource on the particular alloy you have - would be the refiner/factory where the alloy was made.

Ask them about annealing their alloy. Of anyone on the planet they should know what's best for their product.

Almost every company has a different recipe, here of late.


B.

 

[Ste82]

Thank you all! Looks like this gold is an ugly beast!
Thanks Brian, i will tray to quench in alcohol, maybe it change something!
But i'm not having a good feeling with this gold! (

 

[sam]

I've only inlaid 18k rose gold once and it was a pain in the &%#$.

 

[mitch]

i've inlaid INTO rose gold and that was a cast iron b****, too.

 

[Ste82]

I'm happy to know even the true engravers sometime have problems!

 

[Ste82]

Looking around seems like the most used karat for inlay is rose gold 22 Kt...do you think could be a good idea to add gold to my 18 Kt to reach the 22 Kt?

 

[Phil Coggan]

Re- my posts on SL site, annealing will make very little difference.

If you're looking for trouble try inlaying 95% platinum 18mm x 22mm on a curved surface

Phil

 

[silverchip]

So if you are going to use wire, you might consider upping the karatage by adding some 24k to 22k and remake your wire, on second thought ,find an easier project!!!!!!

 

[Brian Marshall]

Did you explain what you intended to do to the supplier who sold you the material?

If, at that point, the supplier did not advise you of the possible problems - I think I would look for a better qualified (knowledgeable) supplier to work with in the future...


Brian

 

[Phil Coggan]

Re- my posts on SL site, annealing will make very little difference.

If you're looking for trouble try inlaying 95% platinum 18mm x 22mm on a curved surface

Phil

I forgot to mention that this was for raised carved work which is a slightly different ball game, actually, inlaying flush red or platinum is not difficult as long as you know what your doing, and hitting it with a 2lb hammer is not the answer

Phil

 

[silverchip]

So if you are going to use wire, you might consider upping the karatage by adding some 24k to 22k and remake your wire, on second thought ,find an easier project!!!!!!

Still the best course of action if you can!!!!

 

[Mike Cirelli]

I think what might be better than using stock wire is to get some rose gold rolling alloy. Maybe mix it for 22kt and you should have a more workable metal.

 

[Phil Coggan]

9k,18k and 22k are as I said is not difficult to inlay, it is far better to inlay it in sheet. As long as the undercutting is done right there should be no problem. If you inlay a large area with say 15 lengths of wire, it will take three times as long and will have 15 chances of the wire coming out.

The more gold you add to the red the less red it will be and sometimes not very distinguishable from yellow.

Phil

 

[Ste82]

No Phil, i'm not even thinking about inlay Platinum!!!
I will follow the advice of sheet inlay and maybe i will add some 24Kt to the alloy, usually which is the sheet thickness to be used for a flush inlay?
Ste