British Military Marching mace

[silkster007]

Hello,

I am new to this forum and I apologise if this ought to be posted in another area.
Can anybody help with the engraving on this mace? It was donated to the School by a former pupil around 200 years ago.
4th Regiment ??

 

[Roger B]

What type of help are you after? If it is a matter of restoring the mace I would see a silversmith to straighten the metal up however if you are trying to determine who the engraver was 200 years ago I wish you luck.

Roger

 

[monk]

you're going to have to supply a lot of historical info if you wish to find out the person that did the engraving. even with the info, i'd not hold my breath awaiting an answer. a member, roger bleile, is a historian of this art. if he cant track it down, i think nobody will. good luck.

 

[Brian Marshall]

I think he is trying to find some historical provenance on this? Like who used it...

Finding information on the engraver, is more instinctive for a group of engravers than the rest of the world.

Once a coupla decades have passed we are not all that important...

Who this belonged to and where it was carried/used remains important.


B.

 

[silkster007]

I think the initials are LLV, London Loyal Volunteers. The date of engraving and engraver would be amazing. I would also like the item to be restored.

 

[Brian Marshall]

If you want restoration you need to go back and put your location in your profile...


B.

 

[SamW]

So, would that be the 4th London Loyal Volunteer Regiment?

 

[Crossbolt]

So, would that be the 4th London Loyal Volunteer Regiment?

London Loyal Volunteers - 4th Regiment

Jeremy

 

[DKanger]

I would also like the item to be restored.

Right...it's always good to screw up the historical provenance of an antique and reduce any value it might have to nothing. If you want it to look like new, have someone make you a replica.

 

[Brian Marshall]

Dave,

The piece could be "restored" in some ways without affecting the historical provenance. Certainly not by re-engraving - but some of the dents could "softened" or removed. The support underneath might be shellac or pitch and possibly need replacing/replenishing if you did that...

If, however, the dents have some known significance - as for example, a couple of them bein' impressions made from striking some important persons noggin - then it may be better to leave those dents alone? Maybe make up a brochure of some kind containing the date(s?), the altercation(s) and identifying the person(s) who got thumped on - and how it all came out in the end...


B.

 

[Roger Bleile]

The monogram on the mace is that of the Loyal London Volunteers. The same monogram was used on the regiment's buttons in the period 1803-1815, though the regiment predates that period somewhat. The LLV consisted of at least 11 regiments. In that time period, regiments were more the size of a battalion in modern times. Each regiment would have had a band and thus a drum major who used a mace.

As to who engraved the mace, it is unlikely that anyone today will ever know. Men who engraved monograms and lettering in the 18th and early 19th century were pretty anonymous craftsmen no different than a cooper, slater, or thatcher. Engravers who did lettering normally worked for a silversmithing firm. In the case where an item was made of silver there would be government mandated hallmarks that would indicate the year of manufacture, silver content, and the maker. Though the mace may have been gilded or silver plated, since it is of brass there are likely no hallmarks.

Additional information may be available by contacting the National Army Museum at Royal Hospital Road, London, SW3 4HT, in Chelsea. Phone: 020 7881 6606.

Regarding the possible restoration of the mace, others on this forum are more qualified in that area than I.