photography question

[Ray Cover]

I am having the dangdest time photographing nickels. I don't know what is so different bout the nickels that makes them harder to shoot than knives but........... I need help.

Here is a shot I just took with my camera set at its highest resolution settings and set for close up.
I have tried using telephoto rather than close up as well with no better results.

Why can I get fairly sharp images on knives but these nickels always come out blury? This is straight off the camera with photoshop work other than to crop it and turn it into a jpeg for posting.

I am thinking about trying to shoot nickels pics through one of my microscopes to see if it helps because this sucks..

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Hi Ray

Beautiful coin.

It looks to me as though the cameras almost struggling to focus. It could be the camera/zoom distance ratio is out of sync. Could you perhaps try pulling the camera back a bit. Or if you are zooming in.............not zoom in so far.

Maybe play with the cameras depth of feild and F stops...........increase and decrease.

Some cameras also have various modes for focusing. That may be worth looking at.

Perhaps also try scanning the coin. From what I can see the coin isn't shiny so it may scan well without reflection.

Just be thankful that it's not a film camera. Remember the "good old days" when you banged of 36 shots only to find 35 of them were no good. An expensive exercise after a while

cheers
Andrew

PS........With my camera if you zoom right in on an object you also have to use the macro mode at the same time. It took me ages to discover that.

 

[Ray Cover]

Here is one I just took through my scope. The details are sharper but the color is off a bit. It is better though.

I played with the distances and zoom. I think your right though it acts like it is having trouble focusing. What I don't get is that I don't have this problem when shooting knives, even when I zoom down as close for details.

 

[Unkl Ian]

My digital camera has a Macro setting,for anything closer than 8".

As an experiment,put a nickle on a knife,and take a pic.

 

[Unkl Ian]

Another possibility,the nickle is so small,the autofocus gets confused.

For some small pieces,when I'm having trouble with focus and exposure,
I'll place a piece of gray cardboard over the item,press the button half way down
so it focuses,pull the cardboard away and press the button all the way down.

 

[Ray Cover]

Do these memory cards wear out?

I often save things on the card to CD then re-use the card. Do those wear out after being used over and over?

Ray

 

[Andrew Biggs]

No, the memory cards don't wear out. Because they are basically small computer chips it's one of those deals where they work..............or they don't. There is kind of no in-between. I suppose if you had it for long enough it would eventually blow a fuse and not work.

I've attached a reworked photoshopped version of your second shot.

To alter the colour.

1. Select an area (I've only partially selected it so you can see the difference)
2. On the menu bar go Image>Adjustment>Desaturate
3. On the menu bar go Filter>sharpen>sharpen

This method works really well for grey type objects like the coin on coloured backgrounds etc.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Daniel Houwer]

I'f you have got a mirror reflex camera, you might want to find the setting where the mirror opens a second before taking the picture. This will annol the fibrations that the mirror makes when opening. Ofcourse you would best use a trypod or other camera fixation unless you are shooting above 200 orso.
If you do not have a mirror reflex, avoid using digital zoom. They are horible.
I've had a nikkon 5000coolpix and that digital zoom was better than most that I saw, but still not good. Oh, I dit get good results whenn I fixed the focus point and then got a little closer of farther off, but that was after you learn to get to know your camera. Mirror reflex with manual focus do it for me.

Hope this is worth something.

Daniel.

 

[KCSteve]

Ray,

Hah! A question where I actually know enough to offer some useful advice!

Lots of good suggestions and advice so far.

Want to know one of the key differences between the shot through the scope and the original shot?
When you shot through the scope the nickel didn't move. When you want to do macro you must use a tripod (says the guy who hasn't used one for his last several shots either). Ok, you can cheat if you know some tricks to getting extra steadiness, but a tripod and a timer (or remote release) are the best thing you can do for these shots.

When you're shooting macro shots like this the DOF (Depth Of Field) can be so shallow that you can't have both the tops and bottoms of the lettering in focus. That's not the problem here (I think) but it's something to be aware of - in fact that's the main reason you want to light the object as brightly as you can. More light lets the camera use a smaller aperature which gives you greater DOF.

As for focus, can you put your camera in a 'manual' focus mode? A lot of times in doing macro work you adjust your lens / focus to get the level of magnification you want and then move things around until the object is wherever you're focused at. That's why they make a thing called a 'macro focus rail' - it's a little X/Y platform that lets you move the camera a few centimeters forward / back / left / right so you can hit the magic spot.

All of this is inspiring me to do my next shots the right way - put the macro lens on the DSLR, put it on my macro rail and Benbo tripod (an odd device that you can use to take a picture looking back up out of a hole), and just generally treat the shot seriously. If I do, I'll also do a quick snap with my point & pixellate and then post both for comparision purposes.

 

[monk]

something i found with my camera, a canon powershot- not a fancy thing, if the object is on a soft or fuzzy background- as opposed to a background that is hard- it doesn't want to focus properly. the focus will slowly move in and out and just continue doing that. if i switch to a hard surface for a background, the thing seems to lock into focus rather quickly.

 

[quickcut07]

Don't know squat about how to help you out. But I do like your nickel. Beautiful job.

 

[Sam]

Ray: Your photo of the nickel is soft, not because of motion blur (camera shake), but because it's out of focus. Yes, you definitely need a tripod for this type of shooting. That's an absolute must. Depth of field at close distances is extremely thin, and there's no room for error. If you're hand holding the camera, you might move slighly after it's locked-on its autofocus, then bingo...a blurry photo. Your scope shot is much better, and as Andrew showed, it's a snap to fix colors in Photoshop.

My advice is to do yourself a big favor and buy a digital SLR. Nickels are the easiest thing in the world to shoot, and there's really no reason to have to spend valuable time struggling with it and becomming frustrated in the process.

 

[Ray Cover]

I have been playing with this and I think Ian has the answer. I am using a Nikon Coolpix 4300. Ya I know it isn't the best.

I use a tripod and use the timer to release the shutter it isn't camera shake. IF that was it I would have it in my engraved knives too and I don't. When Ian mentioned that the size was so small the autofocus sensor thingy could not read it properly a light popped on and I remembered reading that in my manual. The nickel is so small the camera has trouble.

I believe that when the nickel is under the scope it appears to the camera as a large object that fills most of the picture plane. Without the scope the nickel is a small dot on the picture plane and the camera is focusing on the background rather than the nickel itself.

At least that is my current theory.

 

[Ray Cover]

I agree Sam but digital SLRs cost money.

Ray

 

[Ray Cover]

BTW Sam,

I forgot to mention that this past batch of nickels I did to experiment with that punch method of sculpting that you showed on here a good while back. This metal was not as much carved as it was pushed around with a punch.

Ray

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Ohhhhh come on Ray...............don't tell us you went back to the manual!!!!

You're supposed to throw that away with the packaging. It's more fun that way!!!!!

 

[Tim Wells]

Ray,
If you set the selector for a "macro" shot at least on my digital Canon, you have to have the zoom all the way out as in the widest view. If you try to zoom in closer rather than holding the camera close to the nickel, it will not focus. Send that nickel to me and I'll photograph it real good fer ya; the nickel might not make it back though...

 

[Unkl Ian]

With some Auto-focus cameras,if you are shooting two people standing side by side,
it tries to focus on the background behind them.So the trick is to frame the pic the way
you want,then focus on one person by pressing the button half way down,then pan back
to where you want to be and push the button all the way down.

I'd forgotten about the tripod and timer tricks,but they definitely help.

Tripods can be bulky,and take up a lot of floor space.You can also get
"clamp on" bracket gizmos,that can be attached to a table top etc.
They screw into the bottom of the camera,same as a tripod.

I want to get a swivel mount,the kind commonly used for security cameras.
They use the same 1/4-20 thread as real cameras.Then I'll screw it onto a
heavy lamp base for taking studio pics.Heavy enough that it won't fall over,
easy to move,and compact.

 

[vilts]

I'll try to add few bits of info to already this excellent collection.

Actually memory cards aren't just on-off, working or not. There can also be bad sectors. So first maybe just few images are corrupted because of them. Then it probably progresses. It's usually good idea to ditch them right after the bad sectors appear. Memory is cheap, photos not.

It helps to know where and how your camera focuses. Where is the focus point? Usually it's at the center of image area.

Auto-focus cameras focus by looking contrast areas in image. If it finds some edge or contrasty place, it tries to focus until that edge is the sharpest. That is also the reason why focusing on plain walls, especially in the dark, doesn't work out so well. Camera doesn't find anything to focus on, nothing for him to 'sharpen'.

But yes, digital SLR with dedicated macro lens is very-very good idea. I use Canon 5D with 100mm macro lens and it's just incredible what this combination produces. (See http://viljo.marrandi.ee/zippov2/zippo.html for example - this is full-size from camera).

 

[Sam]

Ray: A couple of other things re: nikon coolpix cameras: If the nickel is a small dot on the camera's LCD as you describe, then something's not right. You should be able to fill the frame with a coin. When shooting macro with a point-and-shoot camera you need to be in the wide angle mode, not telephoto. In my old Coolpix 5400, the best photos were shot by zooming all the way out first, then zooming-in just a tiny bit. That was the camera's sweet spot. I could get decent shots with that old camera, but the camera-to-subject distance was so short that it was a constant battle to keep the camera from casting a shadow on the engraved item.

Yes, cameras cost money, and so do microscopes, handpieces, vises, and everything else us engravers use. Your work deserves better that what you're using, and camera prices are coming down all the time. You're running out of excuses.

Lovely sculpting on the coin. Yes, punches are the way to go for sculpting leaves. Phil Grifnee and Alain Lovenberg remove some metal first with rounded gravers while Churchill does it all with punches. You're getting nice, sharp ridges on the leaves which is what we're after when doing this type of work. Remember that punches with large faces work much better than small faced punches. I also texture mine so they produce a nice, soft grey effect as opposed to bright and shiny.

Here's a platinum band done with punches.