Critique Request Small Eros

[Jonathans]

Thanks guys. I'm really sorry if I came across as ignoring the help that so many have offered. Besides the aspect of drawing in Illustrator, I really thought that I had redone my design according to the suggestions made, and if you look at the progression of the thread I hope that's apparent. I genuinely thought I had acted on suggestions to lay down good spirals, and follow flow rules. Then, with my last effort, I thought that that was in fact simple. I couldn't figure out how to be more simple. All the books and videos I have seem anything but simple. It's quite,frustrating to find out that something you finally see as being quite good doesn't pass muster. Having said that, I trust the opinions of the folks here, and want to improve, and am willing to put the time and work in, but at this juncture, besides picking up a pad and pencil, I'm realizing that my brain is just not getting it. I saw Sam teaching a drawing class at GRS recently, and hope I can get into one of those next year. Hopefully something will click prior to then.
My sincere apologies to anyone who thought I didn't appreciate their help.

 

[Mike_Morgan]

The leaf elements in the red circles are an extremely awkward shape that looks like its about to eat the elements in front of it... like an angry dragon.

The element in yellow is exiting the scroll in an obtuse way, and looks extremely un-natural. It doesn't "flow" at all. Study other scrolls online... look at how the leaves exit the backbone. They need to gracefully flow from the spine, and not abruptly jut out.

The red elements are all the same, misshapen leaf, that has been pasted in and scaled to fit. In fact if you changed nothing else, and simply removed the elements I have circled replacing them with nothing, the design would be much better.

 

[John B.]

JONATHANS.
Thank you for your reply and for taking the criticism as it was meant....to be helpful.
You are right about trying to get into one of Sam's scroll design classes.
Just last month a friend and informal student of mine took his class and I immediately saw a complete sea change for the better in her scroll design and layout.
Just a hint, watch for or ask to be put on a GRS early announcement list for the classes. Sam's design class is usually over subscribed so reserve early.
Bye the way....I wish I had both Mike Morgan's and your computer skills. Very useful for some presentations and photograph manipulation.
Best of luck to you on your engraving journey.

 

[Jonathans]

Thank you Sam, Mike and John. I'll start again taking into account your comments.

 

[Jonathans]

Regroup and Start Over

I just received Sam's DVD and now have a better idea as to how to start out simple. Hopefully after watching and going through his process a few times I'll be able to implement some of it.
Here is a pencil drawing of the knife outline, and what I have come up with for backbones. I definitely had trouble getting spirals proportioned well while still being able to have them touch the border.
I could have gone ahead with some leaf elements but thought it prudent to run the foundation by for some input prior to moving ahead.

 

[John B.]

Jonathans,
Good job. but you are right about your scroll/border meeting points. But this is so much better and easier to make constructive suggestions.
You are now recognizing your problem areas before you cover the up with too much to make logical comment. Congratulations.
Please work on these areas before you go further. Look at how Sam, Andrew, didyoung and Dani etc. handle these areas and redraw and repost.
Well done.

 

[Jonathans]

I think I'm developing a little bit of an eye for "Wonkiness", and found some changes I could make. I'm sure the are more, but they aren't apparent to me yet.

 

[John B.]

Much, much better Jonathans. You're beginning to train your eyes to look and see.
You have just one slightly flat spot at the bottom of the C-scroll where it runs into the border.
Tweek this just a hair.
And when you start the leaves and tendrils keep them simple and balance out the negative space between the elements.
Make sure their point of origin flows from and with with the scroll backbone lines.

 

[Jonathans]

Thanks for the help John