Having trouble staying interested and engaged with the hobby.

[dlilazteca]

GRS engraving methods and techniques with Don Glasser dvd

It would be the best 39 bucks you ever spent on engraving. Shows many how to's and errors beginners make. I bought mine from the ngraver site I called in the order make sure you ask for a dvd.

As I have read on this forum time and time again knowing how to properly sharpen your graver is probably one of the most important things, don't get me wrong I'm not an expert I also use a template but the DVD's have really helped



Carlos De La O III

 

[Marcus Hunt]

Im using the lindesy sharpening guides (96 and 116 degree)

I have a myriad of waterstones going up to 8000 grit and 2 diamond stones , one 600 and one 1200 grit.

How often should i be sharpening if im using carbide graver bits?

You have a lot of good advice here JZ. No one ever said hand engraving was easy. H&C is a way to go as your cuts will be deeper and your graver won't slip as much but it does give a different result to hand pushing so you have to decide what you want. Which ever order you decide on (H&C and then hand push for example) when it comes to hand pushing you need to build up muscle memory and motor skills. There is no easy way around this apart from hour after hour of repetition. Boring I know but if you want to engrave manually that's what you have to do I'm afraid.

How are you holding and turning your work at the moment? Without a good vice the chances of your workpiece moving suddenly under pressure is quite high and consequently so is slippage.

If you want to know if your graver needs sharpening get a good loupe and look at the point. If its bright or shiny then it's dull and needs sharpening. Likewise if you see the tip has fractured off. This is much more likely to happen it the face of your graver is too large so make sure your graver is well tapered. Finally, there's the thumbnail test. Rest the point of your graver on the thumbnail and if it slips you need to sharpen, if it grips with little or no pressure you should be okay.

One last thing, sometimes it's possible for a graver to be over sharp, especially for hand pushing. So, after sharpening, dub your point by dragging the heel, once or twice, over a piece of leather that has preferably been impregnated with diamond spray. Definitely do this if you find your gravers breaking on a regular basis.

Good luck and keep cutting but remember you have chosen the most difficult route and a lot of what you've let yourself in for is as boring as hell in the beginning but practice and perseverance will pay off if you stick at it but you really should try and find a class or someone to guide you if possible.

 

[Gemsetterchris]

We did some handpush engraving at college on copper with a sandbag, it is possible..eventually.
Also, you can have problems trying to cut too deep & It's better to try recutting lines gradually to depth.

 

[mitch]

If you want to know if your graver needs sharpening get a good loupe and look at the point. If its bright or shiny then it's dull and needs sharpening.

"...look at the point. If its bright or shiny then it's dull..." Allow me to clarify what Marcus wrote- When he says "the point", he doesn't mean the three facets that comprise the point in general, he means right at THE POINT where those facets converge. if you can detect a tiny sparkle of light right at the very point of convergence, it means the tool is dull. the point of a truly sharp graver reflects no light. (the same trick works when sharpening a knife blade- sight along the edge toward a light source and the dull sections will show as bright spots.)

 

[Marrinan]

A Gravermiester is a completely self contained air assist tool. They are loud. Many of us used them for years. They do a great job. Look for a used one with the 915 hand piece. They have been selling in the $500 range used. If you find an older model the speed of stroke range can be increased but really not required (for 800 - 1200 to 1200 to 2400 strokes per min). Will reduce your learning curve a whole bunch. Fred

 

[jzknives]

A Gravermiester is a completely self contained air assist tool. They are loud. Many of us used them for years. They do a great job. Look for a used one with the 915 hand piece. They have been selling in the $500 range used. If you find an older model the speed of stroke range can be increased but really not required (for 800 - 1200 to 1200 to 2400 strokes per min). Will reduce your learning curve a whole bunch. Fred

correct me if I'm wrong , but if I'm going to invest in an air tool shouldn't I get the best available?

Not trying to be snooty but I hate having to upgrade things

 

[sam]

correct me if I'm wrong , but if I'm going to invest in an air tool shouldn't I get the best available?

Not trying to be snooty but I hate having to upgrade things

Yes you should. The old Gravermeister would be my last choice. But it'll dang sure work if that's all someone can afford. There's been plenty of beautiful engraving done with them.

 

[Beathard]

The cool thing is there is little depreciation. Look at how much the items in the classifieds sell for. Yes it's expensive, but if you get out later you will get most of it back. It will let you do good work. This will allow you to do sellable work that will pay for the equipment. AND IT'S TAX DEDUCTABLE!

 

[Roger Bleile]

In the absence of a microscope, the best thing I have found for inspecting the graver point is this pocket microscope: http://www.harborfreight.com/25x-pocket-microscope-95883.html

I have a couple of older ones that I bought 30 years ago but these cheap plastic ones actually work better than the older ones.

 

[Barry Lee Hands]

There is a lot of good info and advice here.
If you are interested in pushgraving you should get with someone who does it all day, every day, professionally.
If you can learn to pushgrave, I think it is the best basis for more advanced tools, because you MUST learn to sharpen properly to pushgrave.
This will give you the judgement to determine if you need a sharpening system, and which one, if any.
Tools do not need to be expensive or complicated.
Below is a picture of my original set of tools I used many years ago.
I made a living with these tools.
At the time I worked for Colt, Winchester and C.Sharps arms co and engraved dozens of firearms with this simple set.
This is really everything in the way of tooling, that you need to learn the basic mechanics of engraving.
At the top is a round punch, used for peening and as a crutch to sharpen the single point graver on the diamond stone.
there is a square graver, a pushgraver holder and a hammer and chisel, and a loupe.
Most of the best engravers in the world have used tools like this, and many still do.
Pushgraving and hammer and chisel are wonderful techniques for any engraver, I wish you renewed enthusiasm!

 

[Weldon47]

Sounds to me like you are wanting us to convince you that you can do this.
You must convince yourself first and then nothing will be able to stop you.... Grasshopper!

Seriously,

Weldon

 

[Dulltool]

Weldon.... A big thumbs up.

 

[Beathard]

“If you think you are beaten, you are;
If you think you dare not, you don't.
If you'd like to win, but think you can't
It's almost a cinch you won't.
If you think you'll lose, you've lost,
For out in the world we find
Success being with a fellow's will;
It's all in the state of mind.

If you think you're outclassed, you are:
You've got to think high to rise.
You've got to be sure of yourself before
You can ever win a prize.
Life's battles don't always go
To the stronger or faster man,
But soon or later the man who wins
Is the one who thinks he can.â€￾

― Walter D. Wintle

 

[dlilazteca]

Just like the book the little engine who could

Carlos De La O III

 

[mgdesigns]

Although I was a full time bench jeweler and had used gravers to set diamonds, when I first attended a GRS class with Sam Alfano I was a genuine newbie. It took me the first 3 days to quit pushing and let the GRS GraverMax do its job. I bought a new SilentAire Compressor, an Acrobat stand with custom adapter for my ancient B&L Zoom scope, and a new engraver's vise, a Monarch and a 301 handpiece, and went home equipped to tackle the world. 8 years later I am still learning, but I enjoy it a whole lot more. Every job is a challenge, because I still only know the basics. Jim Small said it best to me, "Engrave 1" per day, every day, and you will get better." The better air assisted equipment has made it a much easier path to take on the tough metals that traditional jewelry engravers won't touch (Steels, Stainless, Titanium, etc.), but the best thing was the instruction from Master Sam. His instructional methods with through the scope projecting onto large screens was so helpful, and then he would hand out step by step sheets for us to take home and practice. Please take the classes and listen and practice. Oh learn to sharpen well, dull tools don't cut it - at all.

 

[dlilazteca]

Jzknives

Where to start? I've been at this for some months now, when I started I did not want nor could I afford to spend thousands, but I soon realized that hand pushing or hammer and chisel was going to take me years to learn. So I found some old tools I wasn't using sold them and bought me the Lindsay Classic. I also got some help from people here from the forum I got me a Magna block in payments, I was gifted a book, and I'm now getting one on one instruction from a fellow forum member. I just finished first piece that I can say I can give away to a friend but I would still be embarrassed to post it here but I'm gonna just so you can see that there is hope. I sent a picture to my mentor and he pointed out the 100 places that I can improve on it I'm going to take it back work on it get better give it away and start another. I know I wouldn't be where I'm at if I wasn't using my pneumatic handpiece, help from this forum and its members! I am not telling you which one to buy as both classic and GRS hand pieces are great I've used both all I'm saying is that it would be the best way to go. It would knock years of learning curve. Don't laugh but here's my picture.

One more thing some slips can be erased using a burnisher I learned this from my mentor.

May 2013 time flies




Carlos De La O III

WOW....this post was just liked by someone so i decided to check it out, this brings back memories, look at the book in the background one of the best books money can buy, what I love about that one is that it has character very old has been used I even laminated the cover to keep it from deteriorating any further. Was a gift. One last thing that is some ugly engraving, i guess im my worst critic, I wonder were my current engraving will be in another year. May 2013 time flies


Thank you all for your help

 

[Donny]

jzknives end up quitting? Or sticking with it?

Donny

 

[Eugene Carkoski]

take some classes, take some classes, take some classes,

 

[dlilazteca]

carkoski

look at the date, this is some time ago. Did you read the thread?

Saludos,

Carlos

 

[Bob A]

"If it were easy, everyone would do it." (Tyrion Lannister, fictional character.)