After over 30 years of being a bench jeweler and watchmaker I am venturing into hand engraving. Something I have always wanted to do. I need opinions from those experienced engravers on what you would recommend book and video wise. Also opinion on what tools you would recommend. The only things I have now are power hone and meiji scope with acrobat that I have used for my watchmaker lathe. I am presently looking at the graver mach and the lindsay set up. I would love some opinions of both set ups. For those whom have palm activated set ups do you like over foot pedal control. What ballvise recommendations and etc. Many thanks in advance! Best regards, Larry
just commited to my venture into hand engraving and need your help
- Thread starter laserboy
- Start date
Robert Jobe
Member
Go to the Engrave-In or take a class that will let you try them all. All of the tools will work for someone, but you need what is best for you. As a hobby engraving can get expensive.
I much prefer palm actuation over foot pedal for engraving. For stippling I have much better control with the foot pedal. Not all beginners take to palm operation quickly. Many start with the pedal and work their way to palm as their control develops.
I can't give you an opinion on setups because I only use GRS equipment. Here's a link to my gear.
I can't give you an opinion on setups because I only use GRS equipment. Here's a link to my gear.
RoycroftRon
Elite Cafe Member
I have a grs gravermach with an airtact so it is palm controlled. I love it for my home studio setup. You spread out the cost over multiple parts (the unit, the handpieces, etc).
Lately I have been dragging it to shows and it is a complete pita to move and re-setup. For that reason I am considering a lindsay setup with the palm control and CO2 option just for doing shows. Of course that is a 3k investment for doing shows and I can't justify that right now... Of course if I am blessed in making too much this year and I need a write off that may make it worth it.
That's my perspective $.02
Lately I have been dragging it to shows and it is a complete pita to move and re-setup. For that reason I am considering a lindsay setup with the palm control and CO2 option just for doing shows. Of course that is a 3k investment for doing shows and I can't justify that right now... Of course if I am blessed in making too much this year and I need a write off that may make it worth it.
That's my perspective $.02
He should also be aware that GRS offers an accessory pack that allows thumb/finger control as well as a footpod for foot control. I prefer using the thumb control simply because I am always outrunning my work with the palm control.
mtgraver
Elite Cafe Member
I went from hammer/chisel to palm control, after having an opportunity to try out other pieces at a NRA convention. The palm control was the most intuitive tool I've ever had in my hands. I had tried push graver for years with minimal success but felt proficient with h/c for the 18th c. style work. The PC brought both worlds together flawlessly for me. I agree with Sam that a foot control is much better for stippling so I may eventually add that to the mix. I also think that you should try out all equipment if you can to make a sound decision.
Mark
Mark
Fred Bowen
Elite Cafe Member
I started with GRS equipment and foot pedal control, but had trouble with circulation in my pedal leg. The Airtact was exctly what I needed for that problem and the palm control seems more natural. I found that the GRS Maestro with finger touch element is great for stippling.
RoycroftRon
Elite Cafe Member
I agree with Fred on the maestro with finger control for stippling. +1
medicbeedge
Member
I would recommend looking through the tips archive on this site and www.engravingschool.com which gives you a good knowledge base to start and theres alot of videos on there. As for a block, GRS standard block is pretty good and what alot of people use. If you search on google you can find it at a good price. I have a Linday graver and am satisfied with it. Most of the gravers are upgradeable to a palm control if you choose a foot pedal and find that you dont like it. Hope this helps!
~Brian
~Brian
Tira
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
I just got back from the Basel show with Chris where I used the new En-Set and En-Set Plus for 8 days. I'm hoping to do a full review of the machines in the near future. For right now I'm trying to get back into my schedule and clear the backlog of work on my bench after being gone for two weeks.
I would definitely say to anyone trying out tools to try them all out and decide what is best for you. I have just about all of the systems (Lindsay Air Chasing Graver, Lindsay Palm Control, GRS Gravermeister, GraverMach and GraverMachAT) and will be getting the En-Set Plus as soon as one comes off the production line for me. All of the tools work well, but they all work a bit differently and one person may prefer one set of characteristics and another person other characteristics.
As far as the En-Set machines the major difference between them and the other machines on the market is the speed. The En-Sets start at zero and go from 60 strokes/minute up to 1500 strokes/minute. You can even do just one hit at a time which is helpful for punch dot backgrounds, setting that prong down just one more touch, or coming to the end of a cut and giving the final hit to dislodge the chip. You control the speed with the foot pedal and can speed up and slow down as you need to like around tight turns or at the end of cuts. I found that I was engraving between 240-300 strokes/minute most of the time I was at the show. Each hit has more power so even though the hits are slower the tool advances quite a bit with each stroke. The slow setting is very adjustable and can be a fine cut or a very hard hammering cut. I did a lot of deep relief sculpting at the show and was surprised at how much metal could be moved in a short time with the tool adjusted in the heavy hammer mode. Both models do the slow setting. The Plus also has a second mode where you set the speed (strokes/minute) and then the foot pedal adjusts the power. In this mode the tool goes the same speed, but it starts with less power in each stroke and gets more powerful as you press the pedal. The Plus is a digital model.
Both models come with the handpiece and 3 striker heads. You can adjust the handpiece by putting in the small, medium or large striker head for different types of power/work. The other notable characteristic of the systems is that they use very little air. The En-Set Plus is still in the testing mode for air consumption, but the En-Set Basic uses very little air (I think it's 0.02 CFM) and that is only when it is running. There is no air bleed from the pedal or lines when the machine is not running.
The tool is now going into production and should be available soon. I'm not sure what the US price will be because most of the prices at the show were quoted in Euros. I'll try to find out the availability and price information and I'll check on the air consumption for my full review.
I would definitely say to anyone trying out tools to try them all out and decide what is best for you. I have just about all of the systems (Lindsay Air Chasing Graver, Lindsay Palm Control, GRS Gravermeister, GraverMach and GraverMachAT) and will be getting the En-Set Plus as soon as one comes off the production line for me. All of the tools work well, but they all work a bit differently and one person may prefer one set of characteristics and another person other characteristics.
As far as the En-Set machines the major difference between them and the other machines on the market is the speed. The En-Sets start at zero and go from 60 strokes/minute up to 1500 strokes/minute. You can even do just one hit at a time which is helpful for punch dot backgrounds, setting that prong down just one more touch, or coming to the end of a cut and giving the final hit to dislodge the chip. You control the speed with the foot pedal and can speed up and slow down as you need to like around tight turns or at the end of cuts. I found that I was engraving between 240-300 strokes/minute most of the time I was at the show. Each hit has more power so even though the hits are slower the tool advances quite a bit with each stroke. The slow setting is very adjustable and can be a fine cut or a very hard hammering cut. I did a lot of deep relief sculpting at the show and was surprised at how much metal could be moved in a short time with the tool adjusted in the heavy hammer mode. Both models do the slow setting. The Plus also has a second mode where you set the speed (strokes/minute) and then the foot pedal adjusts the power. In this mode the tool goes the same speed, but it starts with less power in each stroke and gets more powerful as you press the pedal. The Plus is a digital model.
Both models come with the handpiece and 3 striker heads. You can adjust the handpiece by putting in the small, medium or large striker head for different types of power/work. The other notable characteristic of the systems is that they use very little air. The En-Set Plus is still in the testing mode for air consumption, but the En-Set Basic uses very little air (I think it's 0.02 CFM) and that is only when it is running. There is no air bleed from the pedal or lines when the machine is not running.
The tool is now going into production and should be available soon. I'm not sure what the US price will be because most of the prices at the show were quoted in Euros. I'll try to find out the availability and price information and I'll check on the air consumption for my full review.
Thanks for everyones input! I have decided on the gravermach AT. I will probably take a course with GRS in the fall. I wish I could take one earlier but I will be taking Blaine Lewis 1 week course in June or August for advance stone setting. So until then I will rely on videos,books and especially all of you when I run into a problem. I am sure I will be posting alot of questions so please be patient with me. I am really looking forward to my new venture into hand engraving. Again thanks for all the inputs! Larry
Congratulations on taking a class with Blaine Lewis. He's a fantastic teacher and a really nice guy. You'll learn a lot and have a great time in the process.
Thanks Sam! I have heard that about him and you as well. I have both of his videos as well as two of yours that has helped me alot. Funny thing is 5 years ago I Closed my store after 24 years and thought I was a pretty good jeweler than. Last 5 years I have learned so much and my work has improved immensely, all the while having fun again. I hope Jura comes to the states I would like to take a stone setting course from him as well. Again everybody thanks for your inputs! Larry
Jura is a master setter for sure. His work is incredible. Also consider taking a course from Alexander Siderov of Belgium who is teaching a Grandmasters course at GRS this year.
I preferre palm control vs foot, the best way maybe will be can try all the tools in the market,because you can preferre one respect other,i use de Lindsay Palm control Airgraver,i had try the airtact system but the sensation that i had feel is like the handpiece want escape off the hands and you must to go behind her, and i don`t like it very much, while with the lindsay the feeling with the tool is much more natural, furthermore if you want more o less power & speed you only must exert more push with the palm, like you make with a traditional hand push graver.
For stippling with the PC for me is indifferent,with palm or foot,the PC have in the handpiece a regulation of the idle that you can regulate like do you want and is very easy stippling in this way.
It is my personal opinion, but I repeat, will be better try both systems before to see what adjusts better to your way to work
For stippling with the PC for me is indifferent,with palm or foot,the PC have in the handpiece a regulation of the idle that you can regulate like do you want and is very easy stippling in this way.
It is my personal opinion, but I repeat, will be better try both systems before to see what adjusts better to your way to work
Thanks everyone for all of your inputs. I am anxiously awaiting for all of my new equipment to come in(sure did spend alot of my hard earned money from Christmas. If I do become any good at this I might try the Lindsay system. Speaking of that, any opinions on the Lindsay templates? Thanks, Larry
Roger Bleile
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
I now use the Lindsay templates for quite a bit of my sharpening but I still use my power hone as well. If you can afford it it is great to have both. Of course you can always rub your gravers on a stone as demonstrated in the McKenzie video or the Shippers book.
RB
RB
Frank P
Elite Cafe Member
I had the chance to test the EN-SET, and what you get is the best of both worlds... just great and is definitivly on my wish list ..
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