Who's Who of Engravers Directory , need your help

[Roger Bleile]

I would like to nominate to the list of important engravers James Ehlers. Not only is he a skilled and talented print engraver, he also stands in the unique position of professor of engraving arts at ESU. He will undoubtedly have a significant impact on many students of the art.

RB

 

[Roger Bleile]

There are also some bank note engravers that can be added to the list. I've been trying to research 19th century bank note engraving. There are a lot that have simply become footnotes in history but Ormsby and Smillie have certainly withstood time.QUOTE]

Chris, I am familiar with W. L. Ormsby (who definately should be included) who engraved the dies for the roll engraving on all Colt percussion cylinders. I am not familiar with Smillie at all. Could you expand on him. I agree that bank note engravers have not gotten their due recognition in the trade. Here is a link to a story about one of the current bank note engravers at the BE&P: http://www.gwu.edu/~magazine/archive/2006_spring/docs/alumni_newsmakers/dept_alumni_onmoney.html

Roger

 

[CJ Allan]

OK........ I have a couple questions......

As I read Scotts intention for this list .it is of those that contributed a lot to the art of engraving.........

Now it looks like just another list of everyone that ever touched a tool.......
I have never heard of the majority of most on the list so far, and i'm sure nobody else has either........

Below is an insert of Scotts original post.............

(PS) I think anyone on this list should have a short Bio, & a Sample or 2 of their work.....kinda like Rogers list..........

KEY WORDS....... I Think..!!
Not to be confused with me actually knowing anything, or being part of anything that goes on.....

Scott's concept....

""So I propose we create a who’s who list. Not one of every Tom, Dick or Sally who ever made metal chips, but of those who have had great impact on the art overall. Historically names like Rembradt and Durer come to mind, and more recently, L.D. Nimschke, Gustav Young, Griebel, E.C Prudhomme, Alvin White, Ray Virmontez, John Rohner. Renown teachers of the art current or past like Jim Small, Neil Hartleip, John Barraclough, George Sherwood, Sam Alfano or Brian Marshall. Inventors and suppliers like Ray Phillips, Don Glaser and Steve Lindsay of course, People who are currently working whose style is greatly admired or copied like Eric Gold, Ron Smith or of course Steve Lindsay. People who greatly promoted the work or authored books like John Amber, or Ken Warner, Tom Turpin, or Roger Bleile . Those who tops in the field today like Ray Cover, Ken Hunt, Sam Alfano or Phillipe Grifnee, or multiple Italian , German and Austrian engravers. Not just gun engraving but tops in other fields historically such as motorcycle or banjo work. This list in this paragraph is not meant to be all inclusive, I could add to any of the categories, these were just some names I am throwing out that quickly come to mind, so that you can help me get a list that IS all inclusive.!!""


Not too many of those listed so far, have had much of an impact on engraving....much less a "GREAT" impact as originaly proposed....although most are probably good engravers, & have fed their families................. !

Soooo Once again...
Is this a list of any & all engravers............
or is it a list of those who have had an IMPACT of the art as a whole.......... ????


..

Just my thoughts...........

But let the list go on as ya see fit.......



Added: I knew better than to ask a question like thiswhen i posted it...........
I guess it's why I should keep this computer shut off.


Chris........If I run across a copy of that book....I'll grab it up for ya...


. ..

 

[Christopher Malouf]

Hi Roger,

GF Smillie was one of the founders of the American Bank Note Company. From what I've been reading, he probably engraved a large percentage of the notes. Finding a book with examples from these guys is not easy. Some REAL research is needed ... like a trip to the public library in Boston, New York, Hartford or Philly.

I think the significance of 19th century bank note engraving is important because of its impact on firearms engraving today.


Great link too. It's interesting to read about these engravers who have worked on the things we see everyday. I believe the guy that worked on the 1935 $1 (as we know it today) was Max Zeigel who emmigrated from Austria.

Good stuff Roger ... thank-you,

Chris

--------

CJ ... If you can find a copy of Ormsby's Bank Note Engraving published in 1852 .... let me know. Thanks buddy.

...thanks CJ ... you have every right to charge me a finder's fee as this book fetches a premium. What a piece of history!!!

--------

John B....

ok cool ... by the way ... info that connects a name in a list to a real person is a wonderful thing to pass that on to the next generation of engravers. Thank-you.

 

[JJ Roberts]

Scott,
Let's not forget Howard Dove, and Joseph Condon, Las Vegas Nevada..engraver to the stars. Gee I like that title. Keep up the good work.

 

[John B.]

Hi Christopher M.
My reference to Walter K. being a "show me the money" engraver had absolutely no connection to your use of the same phrase in David C. letter thread.
Walter is a great and highly skilled engraver, as we all know.
My point was that he took an old world, practical professional approach to engraving.
If he was paid enough he could and would produce high quality art engraving.
He was also capable of producing some beautiful work with simpler details and background in a more commercial price range.
If we look at some of the greats of the past we can clearly see this was a professional attitude in both the U.S. and Europe in the days when these people were trained.
Being old world myself I highly respect this attitude in professional working engravers.
L.D. Nimschke is a perfect example of this, everything from fine art to production work.
But all good, his production work was just more simple but still great.
This was the case with the wonderful FN/ Browning factory in Belgium.
Some of their top engravers produced everything from the highest exhibition grade work to the standard Grade 1's as the trade demanded.
That is what I was alluding to in Walters's case and was attempting to pay him a compliment.
It is a fairly recent thing for many engravers to limit their practice to only the highest level they are capable of producing.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I am merely trying to say that it is a fairly new phenomenon and not necessarily practiced by some of the older group.
Just my thinking, best. John B.

PS. Whoa! I strayed a long way from Scott’s original thread.

 

[kguns]

Is there a problem with SHOW ME THE MONEY???

Walter was the king, so was Delcour, fast as lightning. These guys knew how to WORK!!!!!!TRAVAIL!!!! To quote Rene, He’d scream that at us all day long in class.

That’s why I do it, for the money. I wish I was doing a better job of that. You would get a harsh answer from my wife as to whether this is a job or a hobby.

I don't want to start who should or who should not be on this or any list. There are folks out there that can engrave circles around all of us that we don’t know about.

What I'm saying is there are a lot of people who have a lot to offer this group. I spent 4 years at L’ecole De Fine Mechanique in Liege and some time in Gardona Val Trompia.

I’ve meet a lot of great engravers. Most of them don’t do it anymore or have passed away, should they not be remembered? That’s for Scott to decide it’s his list. I would say give him everything you’ve got for info,

IT’S OUR HISTORY!

I for one am happy that someone took this on, and that there are enough of us online that such a list as this could even be contemplated, it couldn’t happen any other way.

So don’t handicap yourselves, give up the names and the info. Too much knowledge is not a bad thing, it’s a gift.

Kurt Horvath

 

[Weldon47]

My sentiments, exactly, Kurt! Scott can root through all the info we have provided and compile the list as he sees fit. Well said!

WL

 

[thefox]

thefox

How about Roy Vail?

 

[saint]

Noted engravers

Some other noted engravers are Howard Dove, Denise Therion, Dennis Kies to name a few. It is difficult to create a comprehensive list without getting a lot of help from everyone.

saint

 

[pilkguns]

Thanks for the input everybody. Actually I just saw the additons to this thread that were made by Roger and others last summer. I have sent this information to my webmaster to get it included. I missed a lot of time on the fourms in the recent months. There has been a lot go on in my normally busy schedule since last year so there are lot of things that have gotten pushed aside or dropped because of more pressing priorities. I think I mentioned on here last June that I had fell and severely spained my wrists. I had no use of my right hand/wrist for nearly two months and only limited use of my left wrist for the first few weeks. My right hand is still in the recover process even today. In between and on top of that, is thepellet making machine that I bought from Germany that I have had a lot of issues with and has consumed vast amounts of my time and resources. Many Many things have not happened because of that.

Anyhow I digress from this thread. Please, if you have anything on any of this people that you can easily send me or refer to a link, or even copy and fax, send it.

Yes, CJ, you are right, it is supposed to be the ones who have impacted our art in big ways... and I would like to keep it to that, but it certainly gets complicated as well, some are obvioulsly in, some are obviously out, but there seem to be a whole lot of hmmmmmmmmm, he really should be in there... because if this list becomes the resource I intend it to be, it will draw all sorts of people into it that wnat to know about their engraved gun that JoeBloe engraver did 45 years ago, and well maybe JoeBloe should be there for that reason, but on the other hand, Bob Evans has poured hours and weeks, and years into similar historical efforts that cover much of the same ground. I had intended to fly out there sometime and go through and compare notes at some point, but that hasn;t happened and I think..... I heard that Bob was passing that collection of information onto someone else?

Anyway, whatever info we can get and get online is great for all for all us.

Speaking of info, and maybe this should be in a new thread? But I think it should MANDANTORY for users of this forum to fill out their bio pages. Often when I am responding to someone, I look at their bio, to see what their background is, to know better how to tailor my answer. Most of the time there is nothing there. I would be in favor of asking Sam, and Steve on his forum that in additon to moderating the first few posts to keep out spammers, they also insure that the new poster has filled out their bio to really show thier interst in the engraving communituy. Is that too much to ask?

Also, it seems a several of the names mentioned recently are already there, please look at the online list
http://learn2engrave.com/whoswho.html

 

[coincutter]

The mandatory requirement would be bordering upon legal issues that would result in both forums violating an individuals constitutional rights.

Let me know if it happens so I can delete my account.
Thx in Advance

 

[pilkguns]

Last I knew we do not live in a totaliarain country. Both forums are property of their resepective owners and they can do with them as they please.

Many forums these included require various forms and levels of registration. Asking someone to include thier bio regarding their background and interest related to an esoteric subject like engraving should not be an unreasonable request. Many people make an introduction of themselves in their first post. It would be great if that introduction was in the bio page so that it is findable at a later date as necessary.

 

[coincutter]

You stated:

"But I think it should MANDANTORY for users of this forum to fill out their bio pages."

Now you are changing your tune.

BTW It's spelled Totalitarian and Mandatory
It would be great if everyone did that - true
it would be great if you would hot link everyone's website that is on your list
it does appear as quite a commercial endeavor.

It's not worth getting into a contest of words over.
I think it should be mandatory that all engravers use spell checkers.

I think it should be mandatory that some engravers don't try to think for other engravers.

And I think this conversation is going nowhere.
Have a good day.
Be kind to yourself.

Steve

 

[CJ Allan]

Steve.....Well I guess you sure told him......

Scott...
I agree....and anything I can do to help ya get things together.
I'm just up the road, and happy to do anything I can..

 

[Andrew Biggs]

OK...........I'm going to step in here with my moderator hat on.

So please listen!!!

This conversation is heading in a direction that is against the spirit of the forum and totally unnecessary.

If you have a problem with that................ then I suggest you read the forum rules.

Scott has put up an idea that you are more than welcome to comment on......... but please keep it respectful.

Just remember that Sam has the ultimate say in what will, or won't, happen on the forum.

Andrew

 

[jerrywh]

You left me out. Maybe you should go over the list of Master engravers at the FEGA sight. I don't see how you could forget Joe Rundell. since he won the Engravers choice award this year.

 

[sam]

Thanks, Andrew. Abigail and I were out of town and I just read this thread.

There are quite a few members who don't want a public bio or profile, and I have to respect that.

There are a few members who don't even want others to know they're online here so they have their INVISIBLE switch toggled. Members can't see them online but Administrators can.

 

[Scratchmo]

I'd like to see a few numismatic engravers on the list, most notably, Gilroy Roberts, who was a hand engraver for the Mint AND the BEP. The Gilroy Roberts Foundation still funds engraving courses at the ANA.

Kimon and Euinatos are two known engravers of Ancient Greece who each did their own versions of the Syracuse Decadrachm, who many consider to be the most beautiful coins ever struck.

Also, Robert Scot was the first Chief Engraver of the U.S. Mint and was a hand engraver.

Also, George Washington Hughes, better known as "BO" was one of the original hobo nickel carvers.

Most other numismatic "engravers" are actually sculptors, and most of the early ones are not known by name, but these few stand out as deserving.

 

[Mike Cirelli]

One thing this thread did for sure was to put some real engraving history at our fingertips. If you would google all the names thrown at us in this thread it would take months to read about all the talented individuals.
Don't ruin this thread by getting in a peee****ing match about how the forum should be run.
I feel privileged to be in the same room so to speak with the likes of John Barraclough, Ron Smith, Sam Alfano, Phil Coggan and on an on.